From Fedora Project Wiki
| Sparks | #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings | 00:01 |
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| zodbot | Meeting started Thu Oct 8 00:01:03 2009 UTC. The chair is Sparks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 00:01 |
| zodbot | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. | 00:01 |
| Sparks | #topic Roll Call | 00:01 |
| * Sparks | 00:01 | |
| * jjmcd is here | 00:01 | |
| * bcotton is here (who is this guy anyway) | 00:01 | |
| jjmcd | And according to my watch, you were within a couple seconds, probably IRC lag | 00:01 |
| * danielsmw is here | 00:02 | |
| * Sparks wants to shoot the guy who schedules a meeting in the middle of an amateur radio contest! | 00:02 | |
| jjmcd | There's always a contest | 00:02 |
| ianweller | i wonder who that was | 00:02 |
| Sparks | :) | 00:02 |
| Sparks | 70cm is dead anyway | 00:03 |
| Sparks | Okay, let's get started... | 00:04 |
| Sparks | #topic Old Business | 00:04 |
| Sparks | danielsmw: What the status on the editor for Zikula? | 00:05 |
| danielsmw | Sparks: i've been working on it for the past hour | 00:05 |
| Sparks | :) | 00:05 |
| danielsmw | Sparks: rpmlint comes out clean now | 00:05 |
| Sparks | danielsmw: Very cool! | 00:05 |
| danielsmw | so I think i may go ahead and put it on bugzilla | 00:05 |
| danielsmw | Yup. | 00:06 |
| Sparks | Excellent. | 00:06 |
| Sparks | Let us know if you need any support. | 00:06 |
| Sparks | Thanks for packaging it! | 00:06 |
| danielsmw | Sparks: Will do. I probably will later this evening | 00:07 |
| danielsmw | No problem1 | 00:07 |
| Sparks | rudi: I see you changed the license info on the Fedora brand package for Publican | 00:07 |
| rudi | Yep -- all done | 00:08 |
| Sparks | rudi: Excellent | 00:08 |
| jjmcd | rudi, does that also include the additional localization? | 00:08 |
| rudi | jjmcd -- kinda | 00:08 |
| Sparks | ianweller: Did you figure out how to change the license on the wiki? | 00:08 |
| rudi | It includes the feedback file | 00:09 |
| ianweller | Sparks: it's in localsettings.php | 00:09 |
| ianweller | which is in puppet | 00:09 |
| Sparks | ianweller: So you are good to go? | 00:09 |
| rudi | But "Document Conventions" is part of the publican package | 00:09 |
| rudi | not the Fedora brand package. | 00:09 |
| ianweller | Sparks: sure i'll work on a patch sometime tonight and test it somewhere | 00:09 |
| jjmcd | That seems odd | 00:09 |
| rudi | (I also missed 4 languages in the package I released the other day, there's a corrected package in Bodhi now that should appear soon to fix that) | 00:10 |
| jjmcd | All the langs except Chinese are now building | 00:10 |
| rudi | Well, since "Document Conventions" documents how Publican renders various XML tags, this doesn't tend to change from brand to brand. | 00:10 |
| rudi | If someone came up with a very heavily customized brand that *did* change how those tags were rendered, they could also create a new "Document Conventions" text to ship with that package | 00:12 |
| rudi | Which would override the one in Common_Content/common | 00:12 |
| rudi | Anyway, I'll see if I can package the extra "Document Conventions" translations into a new release of Publican 0.44 for us | 00:13 |
| jjmcd | good deal | 00:13 |
| Sparks | Okay... | 00:14 |
| Sparks | #topic Status on CMS (Zikula) | 00:15 |
| Sparks | #link Zikula#Module_status | 00:15 |
| Sparks | Can anyone provide an update? | 00:15 |
| Sparks | Well, I know danielsmw will be submitting the editor for Zikula for review tonight. | 00:16 |
| danielsmw | Yup. | 00:16 |
| Sparks | Anyone else have an update? | 00:17 |
| Sparks | Okay, moving on | 00:17 |
| Sparks | #topic Status on CC license rollout. | 00:17 |
| Sparks | * #link License_changeover_schedule | 00:17 |
| Sparks | #link License_changeover_schedule | 00:17 |
| jjmcd | kudos to ianweller for his announcement and notoriety | 00:18 |
| Sparks | I think ianweller sent out the announcement on Monday. | 00:18 |
| Sparks | ianweller: Have you received any feedback? | 00:18 |
| ianweller | no | 00:18 |
| jjmcd | Sparks, showed up in LWN | 00:18 |
| Sparks | Cool | 00:18 |
| ianweller | i am looking into the wiki crap at the moment if anybody's wondering | 00:18 |
| jjmcd | Just reach into your bucket of magic pixie dust | 00:19 |
| Sparks | I think quaid was working on contacting previous contributors | 00:19 |
| Sparks | ianweller: do you have a link for that LWN article? | 00:20 |
| * ianweller looksies | 00:20 | |
| Sparks | I think the big thing is going to be #7... Make changes to the guides. Rebuild all current versions and push them to docs.fp.o and repos. (All) | 00:21 |
| ianweller | http://lwn.net/Articles/355546/ | 00:21 |
| ianweller | they just copy/pasted my emai | 00:21 |
| ianweller | email* | 00:21 |
| Sparks | That means that all guides will need to be updated ASAP. | 00:21 |
| Sparks | ianweller++ | 00:21 |
| Sparks | This will be coming up in the near future. | 00:22 |
| rudi | I feel a world of CVS hurt a-comin :) | 00:23 |
| Sparks | #action Sparks to send to the list an action request to all guide leaders for update status of the license | 00:23 |
| Sparks | rudi: Yeah | 00:23 |
| * danielsmw is afk for a bit | 00:23 | |
| Sparks | Okay, anything else on this topic? | 00:23 |
| rudi | Are we just republishing F11 docs? | 00:23 |
| rudi | Or further back too? | 00:23 |
| Sparks | rudi: I think just F11. | 00:24 |
| rudi | +1 !!!!!! | 00:24 |
| Sparks | F10 will be EOL soon anyway. | 00:24 |
| Sparks | rudi: Unless you want to go back to the FC days. :) | 00:24 |
| rudi | Uh.... | 00:25 |
| rudi | NO | 00:25 |
| rudi | :) | 00:25 |
| Sparks | IMO if people are going to want to use some of our information they would probably want to get it from the latest source and not an old guide. | 00:25 |
| * Sparks thinks ianweller got off easy during this ordeal | 00:25 | |
| Sparks | Okay, moving on. | 00:26 |
| Sparks | #topic Shared open-source style guide | 00:26 |
| Sparks | #link https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-docs-list/2009-June/msg00163.html | 00:26 |
| Sparks | Does anyone have an update on this? | 00:26 |
| Sparks | Going... | 00:26 |
| Sparks | going... | 00:27 |
| Sparks | gone. | 00:27 |
| rudi | Still blocked by the NotEnoughHoursInTheDay bug | 00:27 |
| Sparks | rudi: Understood. | 00:27 |
| rudi | Expect some traction after I finish on the Publican 1.0 User Guide :) | 00:27 |
| Sparks | rudi: You might want to shoot ke4qqq an email on this as I think he wanted to work on it but probably has the same bug. | 00:27 |
| rudi | (RSN) | 00:27 |
| Sparks | #topic Guide needs? | 00:27 |
| * ianweller hsa to run | 00:27 | |
| Sparks | Okay, anyone have any guides that are in need? | 00:28 |
| rudi | Sure -- my blocker is getting the content together that legal has agreed to release to the wider community | 00:28 |
| Sparks | ianweller: Cya | 00:28 |
| jjmcd | I sent a wuery to qrplinux-L looking for help | 00:28 |
| jjmcd | no joy | 00:28 |
| jjmcd | I think I will ping QRP-L, a much bigger list | 00:28 |
| bcotton | the RPM guide might need a new owner, i am ashamed to admit that I havent done squat with it all summer :-/ | 00:28 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: On the Amateur Radio guide? | 00:28 |
| jjmcd | affirm | 00:28 |
| jjmcd | bcotton: same bug as rudi? | 00:28 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: Okay. I need to take a stab at some of it. | 00:29 |
| bcotton | jjmcd: a combo of that and NotEnoughExperience | 00:29 |
| Sparks | rudi: Which guide is this that you are having legal issues on? | 00:29 |
| jjmcd | Sparks, it would be nice to have something fairly complete for F12 | 00:29 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: Might be too late in the game | 00:29 |
| jjmcd | could be | 00:30 |
| rudi | No guide -- I got left behind -- I was still talking about the Open Source Style Guide | 00:30 |
| Sparks | rudi: Ahhh | 00:30 |
| rudi | (and Red Hat's internal Style guidelines) | 00:30 |
| Sparks | rudi: understood | 00:30 |
| Sparks | bcotton: What do you need? More help or more time or both? | 00:30 |
| jjmcd | bcotton, you might be able to get some help from Florian. He asked us to do it, probably could provide content guidance | 00:31 |
| bcotton | Sparks: a bit of both. i'm taking a new job later this month, which should give me a bit more time once i get settled. i'll also get more experience with git and rpm building, and so forth | 00:31 |
| Sparks | bcotton: Put the word out on the f-docs-l and see if there are any takers. | 00:32 |
| bcotton | sparks: to help or to take? i'd be okay with either. i know the guide is rather dated, but i dont want to let it languish any more than it needs to | 00:32 |
| Sparks | bcotton: Whichever you feel most comfortable. You'd probably find helpers first, though. | 00:33 |
| bcotton | (i'll also try to hang out in the IRC channel more, i've been fairly absent for a while) | 00:33 |
| bcotton | sparks: can do! | 00:33 |
| Sparks | Okay | 00:33 |
| Sparks | jjmcd and rudi: How goes the RNs? | 00:33 |
| jjmcd | Well, | 00:33 |
| jjmcd | I need one small edit before I make the beta rpm | 00:34 |
| jjmcd | Next move I guess is to update docs.fp.o | 00:34 |
| rudi | jjmcd -- I've been doing that as langs hit 100% | 00:34 |
| jjmcd | We have been building every night anf the L10N gang has been working hard | 00:34 |
| Sparks | excellent | 00:35 |
| rudi | A couple of thoughts: | 00:35 |
| rudi | 1) this time, I think we should only move langs to d.fp.o if there's been L10N work in the current cycle | 00:35 |
| rudi | 2) langs should remain "Drafts" until they hit 100% | 00:36 |
| rudi | I think we're getting to the point where we should present readers with something a bit more polished | 00:37 |
| rudi | Some of you may have seen the French L10N team take a firm stand on this recently ;) | 00:37 |
| jjmcd | Last time there were a lot of langs at 80-90%, shouldn't we pull the trigger on those? Or should we encourage the translators to move that last few percent. | 00:37 |
| Sparks | I didn't | 00:37 |
| Sparks | rudi: Can you elaborate? | 00:37 |
| rudi | (They nuked the entire F12 RN fr.po file because they didn't want to see mishmashed docs published) | 00:37 |
| rudi | (and don't have plans to translate the F12 RN) | 00:38 |
| rudi | jjmcd -- I think we need to provide the encouragement to squeeze out that last 10%-20% | 00:38 |
| Sparks | rudi: So let me get this straight... There were French translations and they removed them all? | 00:39 |
| rudi | Sparks -- yes | 00:39 |
| rudi | French translations carried over from previous cycles | 00:39 |
| Sparks | rudi: That's not going to sit well with me at all. | 00:39 |
| rudi | For headings and stuff | 00:39 |
| Sparks | rudi: Why did they do that? | 00:39 |
| Sparks | What was the reasoning? | 00:40 |
| rudi | Sparks -- because they saw us (docs) publishing half-complete work in the past and didn't want it to happen again | 00:40 |
| jjmcd | Sounds so terribly French of them | 00:40 |
| ryanlerch | rudi: what was the % translated when they nuked it? | 00:40 |
| Sparks | so they aren't going to do them at all? | 00:40 |
| rudi | Sparks -- they have no plans to for F12 | 00:40 |
| Sparks | I'm not good with that | 00:40 |
| rudi | ryanlerch -- only about 10%–20% | 00:41 |
| rudi | Reused strings. | 00:41 |
| Sparks | Okay... anything else? | 00:42 |
| rudi | It does mean, however, that if they decide that they want to do RN in French for (say) F13, they'll need to rebase the PO to F10 | 00:42 |
| rudi | (or start from scratch, as they choose) | 00:42 |
| Sparks | That's just nuts | 00:42 |
| rudi | True, but they probably didn't realise that they could just ask us not to publish the doc ;) | 00:43 |
| Sparks | I'll keep my thoughts to myself at the moment. | 00:43 |
| rudi | And, I sympathise with their desire not to publish half-finished work to the world | 00:43 |
| Sparks | Okay, moving on. | 00:43 |
| Sparks | Anything else in the guide department? | 00:43 |
| Sparks | #topic New guides? | 00:44 |
| Sparks | Any new guides to be discussed? | 00:44 |
| jjmcd | You don't have enough? | 00:44 |
| Sparks | I don't have enough time to work on the guides I want to work on! | 00:44 |
| Sparks | :) | 00:44 |
| Sparks | #topic Other business | 00:45 |
| rudi | Just noting that the Virt Guide is up | 00:45 |
| Sparks | Anyone have anything else they want to talk about? | 00:45 |
| Sparks | rudi: +1 | 00:45 |
| rudi | On the F12 drafts page | 00:45 |
| jjmcd | Sparks | 00:45 |
| rudi | Check it out! :) | 00:45 |
| jjmcd | You are aware that the beta meeting moved a week | 00:45 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: Yes... Was going to mention that to you... :) | 00:45 |
| jjmcd | :-) Poelstra sent me a note, I wasn't sure it also went to you | 00:46 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: I saw it on the logistics list. Are you on that? | 00:46 |
| jjmcd | Not sure, don't think so | 00:46 |
| jjmcd | I already have too many lists | 00:47 |
| Sparks | Okay, that list was created as a joint list kinda thing... mutual aid? | 00:47 |
| Sparks | Okay, anything else? | 00:48 |
| jjmcd | Yep, the note from JP was posted to logistics so I guess I am on it | 00:48 |
| Sparks | I actually have something. | 00:48 |
| Sparks | The first meeting after the F12 release I'll accept nominations for "leader" of the Docs Project. | 00:49 |
| Sparks | We'll give that a week and then we'll have a poll setup to vote. | 00:49 |
| Sparks | So be thinking of someone you'd like to see running this thing. | 00:49 |
| Sparks | I think it is a good idea to do this every release or two... | 00:50 |
| jjmcd | I don't know if you can get out of it that easy | 00:50 |
| Sparks | just to keep the ideas new and the momentum moving. | 00:50 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: One can try. | 00:50 |
| Sparks | jjmcd: All I have to do is nominate you. :) | 00:50 |
| * ryanlerch nominates zodbot, he is always in meetings... | 00:50 | |
| rudi | lolz@ryanlerch | 00:50 |
| Sparks | ryanlerch: That's true. And he does take really good notes. | 00:50 |
| * bcotton seconds ryanlerch's nomination | 00:50 | |
| jjmcd | I'll decline, but maybe I should nominate EvilBob, he is always at these meetngs, too | 00:51 |
| bcotton | but here's a question: why can't zodbot be a she? | 00:51 |
| EvilBob | that is what I get for having a good bouncer | 00:51 |
| Sparks | bcotton: zodbot sounds too masculine | 00:51 |
| jjmcd | what about Sonar_Gal? | 00:51 |
| jjmcd | Always coming and going | 00:52 |
| Sparks | :) | 00:52 |
| Sparks | Okay, anything else? | 00:52 |
| danielsmw | ls | 00:53 |
| * danielsmw apologizes | 00:53 | |
| Sparks | rm -Ir danielsmw | 00:53 |
| jjmcd | better than firefox http://myfavepornsite & | 00:53 |
| Sparks | 5 | 00:54 |
| Sparks | 4 | 00:54 |
| Sparks | 3 | 00:54 |
| Sparks | 2 | 00:54 |
| Sparks | 1 | 00:54 |
| Sparks | Thanks everyone for coming! | 00:54 |
| Sparks | #endmeeting | 00:54 |